The indie porn scene in Germany is small and characterized by familiar faces. It is rare to come across newcomers without industry experience who manage to carve out a permanent place for themselves in the niche. The founders of the porn platform CHEEX, Denise Kratzenberg and Maximilian Horwitz, have succeeded in doing just that. In an interview with PORN BETTER, Denise talks about her first steps in the adult industry, unexpected hurdles and her vision for the future of the industry.
Introduce yourself briefly: What are three things our readers should know about you?
I am very emotional, impulsive and chaotic. Many people might see these three characteristics as a disadvantage in my job, but these are precisely the things that have often helped me in life. When an idea, a question or a thought grabs me, I don’t let go. Then I’m completely in the tunnel and forget space, time and usually also that my laptop should have been plugged in long ago. I often find good and pragmatic solutions when everything is going haywire and every emotional side goes hand in hand with empathy.
What was the idea behind CHEEX and what did you want to do differently from other porn platforms with your platform?
We wanted to create a service that shows sexuality authentically, in all its diversity and free from harmful stereotypes or stigmas. CHEEX should not only make you want to have sex, but also inspire our community to try out new things, explore their own sexuality in a self-determined way and not have to constantly ask themselves whether they are actually “normal”. Our aim is to break down shame and taboos around sexuality and porn and contribute to a more open, self-determined culture of pleasure. The combination of pornography and sexual education makes CHEEX unique. In our opinion, they go hand in hand to bring us closer to our vision of a more sexually liberated society.
Both you and your co-founder, Maximilian Horwitz, actually come from different industries – you’ve worked in everything from business analyst to catering start-ups, Maximilian in e-commerce and FinTech. How long has your interest in porn and sexuality been with you? How did the decision to set up in this area come about?
When does sexuality not actually accompany us? I’ve been thinking about this topic for a long time, especially in a social context. For example, who actually determines what is considered “normal” and what is not. Everyone lives sexuality in some way, but hardly anyone talks about it. The idea for CHEEX started at a dinner with friends. At some point, the question came up: “Do you actually watch porn?” My friends in particular didn’t feel at all attracted by the conventional offer and were reluctant to talk about the subject. When I got home, I spent half the night researching. What does it actually take to make sexuality more accessible? When I told Max about it, he was immediately on board and ultimately pushed us to found the company. Our first steps were rather experimental: we developed a relaxation app with self-recorded ASMR. We are still embarrassed by the recordings to this day. When our test group clicked on “Seductive” the most in the categories, it became clear at some point that we had landed on the topic of pornography.
Before you founded the company, were you aware of how many hurdles are involved in working in the adult industry – both legally and because of the social stigma? What was the first reality check in this regard and how do you manage to overcome these hurdles?
Of course, we were aware that sex and pornography are sensitive topics, but we underestimated how strong the stigma really is. At the time, I called the bank and asked for a loan as a matter of course. Looking back, that was naive, but it was precisely this lack of prejudice that gave us a certain drive. We weren’t afraid to just get started. The industry itself is like a black box. When starting up, you can usually find all the information online or via networks, but there is no easy-to-find data or contact persons for the porn industry and hardly anyone really speaks openly. This means you mainly have to rely on your gut feeling. Fortunately, there are always people who will help, but you have to actively seek them out. Without individual supporters who are willing to break the stigma, CHEEX would not exist today.
How has your own perspective on pornography and the industry changed through your time at CHEEX?
Many people have an opinion on pornography without really knowing anything about it. The industry is extremely complex and has so many facets. A simple ‘porn is good’ or ‘porn is bad’ doesn’t do it justice at all. There is no black and white, the reality is much more complex.
What is the best feedback you have ever received from CHEEX users or business partners?
The best feeling is when the vision resonates with people. When someone shares with me that CHEEX has helped them find their own sexuality again, feel more comfortable in their body or connect with partners. That’s totally motivating!
If you could wish for three things for the future of CHEEX, what would they be?
I particularly hope that the existing stigmas surrounding sexuality and pornography will be further reduced. Especially in the infrastructure, for example with payment providers or social platforms. It would be nice if companies didn’t automatically exclude us just because we work in a so-called ‘sensitive’ area. I would also like our vision of sexual liberation to reach even more people. That people feel empowered to discover their sexuality, remain curious and see sex as a natural and positive part of their lives.
But above all, I would like to see an open society in which we can talk about our needs. Where conversations about sexuality are natural, without shame or taboo.
Photos: CHEEX
Find out more about Denise and CHEEX here:
